For me, I don’t separate the two.
They are far too much connected with one another.
My masturbation was a form of lust seeking behaviour as well. It always was. It’s a slippery slope. Best to avoid it as well, but that’s my perspective. Thanks
I feel like this is very much down to the person.
For me, I don’t see anything wrong with masturbating, my therapist has said that there’s nothing wrong with masturbating in a healthy way (sensation focused masturbation).
However, masturbation is something I am abstaining from in addition to porn, because for me I have found that I am unable to masturbate without imagining porn or pornified fantasies about people I know/have had sex with previously.
Will this change in the future? Maybe? I don’t know. But certainly for now, my sobriety is more important than a risky experiment with masturbation.
Also worth noting, after a certain point, you kinda realise that you don’t need to masturbate. I don’t know if that sounds stupid but I know early on I really struggled because I’d go a week or two without, and it would feel like it was all I could do to not masturbate, and it was the hardest thing in the world. But now, it’s almost 9 months since I last masturbated and for a few months now it’s like the urges are way diminished, and when I get them it’s easier to say no.
I’m not saying I’m a saint, and I’m not saying it’s easy, I still get other very unpleasant urges that can be difficult, I’m just trying to say it gets better with time.
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Thank you for comment. It was very insightful.
I have noticed that even after 60 days my urges to masturbate have diminished, but i still get my brain chiming in with rationalizations telling me reasons why i should/could masturbate without porn or fantasy.
But like you guys said i don’t want to ruin my sobriety to porn by masturbating.
I’m curious. If you feel okay talking about it, What do mean by the other urges?
Yeah, that sort of “fake rationalisation” is what I like to think of as my “addict brain”.
These fake rationalisations are what I’ve found tends to lead to a slippery slope and relapse.
The longer you go in recovery, the quieter your addict brain is, and the easier it is for your sober brain to stay in control and be truly honest and rational.
Other urges are to have anymous hookups. I won’t go into more detail than this as I don’t think it’s relevant to your original question, and I don’t want to spend any more time thinking about negative thoughts that I don’t need or want to be giving the headspace to.
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I love this. So very true. The early stages are hard, but the longer you go, the easier it will become.
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I went to a estate sale today and saw playboys on a table.
I had the urge to open up one and page through it. But i thought to myself that that would be a porn relapse too, even if it wasn’t from a porn site.
I didn’t open any of them.
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Another interesting question for you guys:
Do you stay away from Dating Apps while rebooting?
And how long would you stay away from them while rebooting?
I would say if your whole purpose of having them is to have women to oogle/look at then you should stay away.
But if you are reading the bios and actually trying to find someone then it might be fine.
But hears the thing you’ll still look at their bodies even if it isn’t your main focus, so it might be best to stay away for the time being.
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Really good on your part of not opening the pages. That’s a huge success in my books. Amazing work!
You should be proud of yourself.
It depends on where you are at in your recovery. Can you use a dating app without deceiving yourself?
I was about 2 years into my recovery before downloading a dating app. I genuinely wanted to find a partner, not a fuck buddy or a hook up.
Edited to add: after 3 months of swiping, I matched with a guy with an awesome beard. I deleted the app and been rocking along as mrs. Beard for almost two years now.
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I’m married so I don’t go on dating websites, but I have heard at least a year of sobriety is needed before you start into a relationship.
It varies for everyone and it’s different for everyone depending on their level of addiction. Some it could be a couple of months or weeks and they are good, others it might take many more months.
My stance on dating websites has always been a little like they are not necessary.
Even before I was married, my view was we should try and meet someone we either go to school with, or work with. Somebody that shares the same interests, and is on the same path as us.
It starts off as just being friends, you really get to know them, and then kind of build from there. You aren’t necessarily thinking this friendship would amount to something right of the bat, but on dating websites, I believe it’s there from the start.
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I’m married and have been for 17 years so I’ve never used a dating app. But if the idea is “do you use software that is designed to play with your mind’s sense of happiness and anticipation, and keep you coming back for some stimulus” - and that is exactly what dating apps are designed to do (it is not the only thing they are designed to do, but it is one element of their design; to keep you wanting to log in and explore, and to show you more and more of what you like, the more you are online) - if that is the idea, then I would say no:
I don’t go to Facebook or Instagram any more for that exact reason. (The article linked above also mentions Netflix as a platform that uses these mental manipulation techniques.) I like Talking Sober because there is no algorithm here. The threads and posts are always and only in order by the most recent post. That’s it. No tracking me and prompting me to look at stuff it “thinks” will keep my attention.
In early sobriety (and even in growing sobriety like mine) I am very vulnerable to manipulation by software. I would stay away. Nothing will come from it that will help you reach your goal, and there is potential significant harm that could come.
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I am staying away from dating apps.
The main reasons…
- They keep you wired in to chasing “cheap” dopamine.
- They allow you to objectify and judge people on their looks, I think it can easily become dehumanising. Not as bad as porn, but it’s a slippery slope…
- For me, I just have a gut feeling that if I went back on dating apps it would only be a matter of time before I relapsed to porn and hookups.
Why don’t you look at your dating with regard to the 3 circles?
Figure out what is healthy dating, what is unhealthy dating, and what is in-between/grey area.
The three circles are a tool of recovery, and one that I think is often overlooked beyond being used to identify each person’s addictive behaviours.
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Can you explain the 3 circles to me?
I think i heard it before i just need a recap.
It’s a core concept in the SAA program (Sex Addicts Anonymous) - they have details about it here:
The sex addiction recovery clinic I attended in my early sobriety used it as a core practice in their introductory group work. It was helpful for me to get a sense of how sexual behaviours can be seen and defined.
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Interesting.
This made some things clearer for me about my recovery 
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Day 75 from MO
Day 10 from P
One of the features i like best about sobriety from MO is my mind is clearer.
i feel like i can pursue my goals easier.
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Love this. The mind does way more clearer the more you go without. It’s about dopamine. You are rewiring your brain.
Just went to the gym and I feel good. And to think i had some social anxiety around going in the first place.
I need to remember to not PMO after good encounters either. Sometimes in our recovery we feel like we want to double down on a good day with a cherry on top being a pmo session, but that isn’t any desert. It ruins the day.
Pmo is no gift to anyone. Keep remembering that.
Our goal is to rewire to be attracted to and attract real life partners.
Replace our bad habits with good ones so we can attract better things in our lives: better hobbies, a partner, a better work and home life, etc.
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Honestly sometimes stuff is unavoidable and it doesn’t have to be much, I get it. Malls for example have stores in them that I have no want to visit yet when I walk through a mall the advertisements are huge and easily viewable. In this situation from what you are saying I try to not give it power. For example, when I see something that is triggering or whatnot I recognize what I saw and register how I feel about it but then ask does that serve my life in any way? No ok then cool moving on.
It’s not always easy but the more effort you put into trying to push it away or ignore it the more likely it will stay taking space in your brain not leaving you time to give attention to anything else.
Your doing good, I hope that helps.
Parents left to go to a meeting and like clockwork my urges spike up telling me i should MO, but i don’t need that in my life. It’s unecessary. It wastes time and energy. It doesn’t move me towards my goals and makes me feel like crap afterwards. And plus if you engage with a pleasure homeostasis in your body will make you feel pain/bad after to even you out.
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