Sorry to hear that. I agree; it can be a lot sometimes. You didn’t ask for it, but your post prompted me to try and put some thoughts down and the diatribe below is the result.
It is unfortunate that some very popular sobriety programs insist that the only path to empowerment is through religion. It is good that those programs help a lot of people achieve sobriety and find a community, but in my opinion it just creates a new addiction - one that refuses to acknowledge true reality in favor of a fairy tale. Also, because of the insistence that all empowerment comes not from the individual but from their HP, the addict is fearful of ever questioning/challenging their new worldview. After all, it is “only through their HP” that they were ever successful at beating their chemical addiction. To “abandon” their HP would “certainly” lead to relapse, because it wasn’t their actions which made them successful, but their complete abandonment of reality to “surrender to faith”.
And of course, once the new religion-addict is hooked on their new community’s social benefits and disempowering external empowerment, their new spirituality begins to feel absolutely central to their identity (hence all the spiritual “virtue signaling" in the other chats). They are now even more susceptible to regressive, dogmatic world views and politics, which is where their views cross over from harmless to harmful to others in society. After all, when you already believe in fairy tales because they are convenient and useful to you, you can convince yourself/be convinced of just about anything. For many, any action taken by political or faith leadership, no matter how anti-humanist, can now be justified as long as it seems to align with the world view of the new social club they are too afraid to walk away from for fear of losing their community and having to face personal empowerment/accountability.
Sorry to vent. Also not trying to bash anyone in particular. I don’t want to give the idea that I dislike anyone in the other chats who are overly religious. All I am saying is that for those people, a bit of self-awareness and introspection could go a long way in a world with enough zealots already and in a community where many do not view the world through a similar lense. This is just the spiral of religious dependence as I see it, relating to addiction support groups. Religion is one hell of a drug, and just like being the only sober person in a bar full of drunks, it can feel very isolating (and annoying. and exhausting) to feel like the only religion-sober person in a world full of “spiritual drunks”.
I hope you stick around in TS, though. We reality-facers need each other to keep sane, lol.
Thanks for that Brent. Me too thinks that leaving now is just not the right thing to do. For me. Don’t want to feel like I’m being driven out of my recovery home for the last 6.5 years. And yes, there’s enough like minded people here, people that stand for humanity, for inclusiveness, for rational thought, for logic, for true feelings, for connection between humans and all living beings, without the need for some unseen outside force. We’re in this together you know. We can do this together. And I’d be sorry to see you go Col.
I feel like this is a good thread to drop some thoughts. I have pretty much dropped my thread since I’m no longer in the lounge. I miss the small feeling of protection.
3 months ago my husband had “an awakening” He texted me and told me “This is going to sound crazy but god came to me last night” I was raised in the church until I was a teenager and was finally allowed to stop attending. Even as a child, I never remember feeling god or truly believing in a higher being. So for him to say this, yes it did sound very crazy to me. He has always been religious/ spiritual and has said he would pray but because things didn’t happen for him he thought he had been forgotten. Anyways, so he tells me god has come to him and taken his addiction away and that he has an overwhelming need to go to church and start studying the bible. He is 3 months off coke, a little over 2 months without cigarettes and a little over a month into working out and eating healthy. All positive things and I am so grateful because for so many years he has struggled with addiction. BUT the religion is almost a divider now in our relationship. (Plus the fact that he quite literally woke up one day a completely different person.) There are some things that are just off the table for us to talk about now
I have a runner friend now and we have been meeting on fridays to run for about 7-8 months now. She is also very religious. The last time we ran together she was asking me about my health struggles. (Some may know, some might not but I have a blood disorder called hereditary angioedema. I was born with it. My dad, aunts and nephew all have it and plenty of people in my ancestry) Anyways, I explain my condition and she looks at me and says well you know what I’m going it say… “Give it to god and he will heal you” I was silent the rest of the run. I felt almost insulted. The medical community doesn’t have a cure for my condition and to suggest I should just give it to a fictitious figure and I’ll be healed feels insensitive. Rounding back to the hubs. I tried to talk to him about the interaction because it really bothered me. And he agreed with her and said my heart is too hardened towards god. So then I felt double insulted. He has been by my hospital bed while I recovered from episodes. He has watched me swell in every single part of my body over the 15 years we have been together and for him to agree…. I was flabbergasted.
He is about to do his second fast and keeps saying you could do it with me. I’m in the middle of a running training program and have a 7 mile run on friday. I’m pretty sure I shouldn’t try to do that in the middle of a 3 day fast. Not to mention I like food and don’t see the point in only drinking water for 3 days.
I think the thing that spurred this post is the pressure I’m feeling from not just him but also runner friend. She keeps inviting me to church related events. I went to a brunch this past weekend and found out the day before that it was all ladies from her church meeting up. I feel like she withheld that information so I wouldn’t back out.
I am not interested in being religious. I am not interested in in going to church or doing daily/weekly bible studies but he is. He will make a comment about how I need some jesus in my life or something similar
Well, thanks for coming to my Ted talk and letting me vent it all out
That’s all of it right there. Wishing you continued good health and peace in your relationships.. that’s difficult for getting it from both sides. I’m sorry.
One thing I have actually done before with my wife when trying to express myself on complicated or touchy subjects, is to actually write out my thoughts completely and just ask her to read it, then ask me clarifying questions. This helps me to choose my words very carefully and avoid getting emotionally worked up while trying to articulate something difficult.
Your mileage may vary, but maybe it is an approach you might consider trying if you think it would be beneficial.
Thanks, everyone, for your comments and thought-provoking posts. I’m not going to walk away either, not after all the hard work and effort I’ve put in to get this far. I know being here works, and if I leave, then who knows? Connection—that’s right, isn’t it, Mno? Sure it is. I will take a break from the check-in thread and do a quick daily check in here.
@Runningfree Jen Im flabbergasted also and discusted if Im totaly honest and definately no fasting.
Honestly my mind boggles at ‘human behaviour’ at times.
That’s a really solid idea honestly. I have a tendency to get worked up and not think before I speak when trying to communicate something that is bothering me
I had read where you posted on his newfound religiosity…that would be a lot to bear. And I am sorry about your runner friend, it does sound like a bit of a set up getting you to the luncheon.
I cannot imagine how to handle this new situation in your marriage. It sounds really hard and uncomfortable…especially him making comments about you needing Jesus. I doubt I would react well to that.
Idk, I wonder if that is how my husband felt about my conversion from drinking to sobriety? Life certainly tosses us a lot of challenges.
I am glad you can vent here. I find myself as well not feeling as welcome on certain threads /spaces, so I feel you there a bit. You are definitely heard and seen here, which is a wonderful thing. Wishing you some clarity and peace.
I also wonder that about the drinking to sobriety conversion because I have been sober from drinking for over 4 years. I know people change when becoming sober so I wonder if he felt something similar to how I’m feeling about him being a different and new person.
Me neither. I can definitely start espousing how much it has lightened my load if friends ask about it. But mostly with my partner it isn’t something we discuss much anymore after all these years.
Yesterday was a really trying and testing day for us at the hospital. As always, we got through it; we keep going. This seems to be my mantra of late.
I apologize to you all for my little hissy fit. During those few hours of reflection, I was so annoyed and could have lost everything I’ve worked for.
Deep breaths…day 103.
I am glad I got good sleep. Accepting I lost that court case is challenging. I experienced much injustice and that makes me feel helpless and powerless.
People who believe in God tell me it‘s beyond my understanding and that it‘s part of a bigger plan. That perspective doesn‘t work for me.
It is my deep conviction that people act either from the source of love or from the source of fear. I try to always choose love. A part of me — and it may be the naïve part — is devastated when other people let themselves be guided by their fear and accept that this may harm others. Or, even worse, when they consciously cause harm to others.
So, this time someone caused harm to me and all my attempts to stop him failed. I am working on accepting this bitter truth. It’s a big pill to swallow.
Staying sober and aware without god is sometimes about dealing with hard reality, isn‘t it?
and said my heart is too hardened towards god. So then I felt double insulted. He has been by my hospital bed while I recovered from episodes. He has watched me swell in every single part of my body over the 15 years we have been together and for him to agree…. I was flabbergasted.
or something similar
