PMO - Porn, Masturbation, Recovery

Life in Recovery
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1841

My intention is not to “gang up on you” but I second Kevin here. I know it’s not a popular pov.

I chose celibacy waaay before I ever even started recovery. I found that sleeping around only corrupted me internally. Pmo was my only “outlet” for years, until I decided to give that up too. I was single when my recovery began and had A MASSIVE battle of giving up “my last resort” of sexuality. Personally, I know I have no way of going back to masturbation. It is so deeply rooted in my addiction that I’m probably never going to be able to untangle it. My therapist even suggested that I could still masturbate but I knew I couldn’t entertain that idea. I knew where it would take me.

So how can you engage with your sexuality then? What is it that we long to have through sex? Companionship, intimacy, pleasure and connection. I believe that a mere physical (sexual) act alone can’t accomplish those, so there needs to be more. I never had those things through one-nighters or masturbation, at least. I discovered in recovery that self-love and acceptance are the birth place for good sex. If I’m disconnected from myself, I can’t connect with others. If I’m content with myself, I’m able to give instead of expecting or chasing something. I built up my self worth in front of a mirror a piece by piece. These not subtitues for sexuality, but the start point.

I embarked on a journey of discovering what femininity is and what it means to me to be a female. My thoughts towards sex and sexuality changed to more positive as I was able to embrace myself wholly. The way I see masturbating is that it’s a counterfeit of love and connection. It’s like taking a short cut in a race and then being disqualified for it.

I understand I’m probably biased in my views since I don’t see much value in masturbation. It would be an issue if I or Hubby started to do it (we have had conversations about it and are on the same page). I’m glad I chose to be celibate until we got married.

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1842

No no, all good, I appreciate both your and @KevinesKay responses! :blush:

Maybe I haven’t come across in the way I was wanting to. I’m not anti-celibacy per se, but I think in my situation, while it has been a good circuit-breaker to reboot my brain from my addiction, I also feel like I’ve hidden behind it as a (poor) excuse to not crack on with proper recovery (working the steps etc) and possibly been using it as a punishment for what I did when in active addiction.
I’ve felt like any sexual thoughts and feelings are bad, and I don’t think that’s a healthy way to live life. Obviously I don’t want to fall back into addiction, but if I’ve used abstinence as a punishment, that’s not a healthy way to stay sober. Someone in my SAA meeting a few weeks ago said something about abstinence being different to recovery, and it really struck something inside me. I’ve been abstinent, but I don’t feel like I’ve been fully engaging in recovery if that makes sense?

I’m not trying to justify acting out. I don’t want that. I don’t want to go out and sleep around. I don’t want to go back to bingeing porn and cybersex fuelled masturbation “sessions”.
But I also don’t want to just bury any kind of sexuality away, that doesn’t feel like a healthy way to cope with life, just like acting out wasn’t a healthy way to cope either.

I also am not saying that I’m ready to masturbate right now (and maybe I’ll decide I’m not going to at all), like you it was deeply ingrained in my addiction.
However, if I work it through my circles, and talk it through with my therapist, sponsor, and other fellows, then I stand a better chance of figuring it out.

You mentioned intimacy, pleasure, and connection as reasons for having sex. Can one not be intimate and connect with oneself by giving pleasure through masturbation?
I really like what you said about self-love, acceptance, and self-worth though, those things I am trying to work on in order to be and feel better.

I think it also depends on how we look at masturbation. If you look at it just as a cheap means to orgasm, then maybe yeah that’s like taking a shortcut in a race.
But if it’s relaxed, sensation focused rather than orgasm focused, and an expression of self love & self care. That to me sounds more like running yourself a nice hot bath after a long hard day at work.

…But maybe that’s just me making excuses and justifications because someone suggested masturbation might be okay and I’ve latched onto it.
I clearly have more thinking and more work to do on this. But I’ll leave it there for now :joy:

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1843

Hey Rich! I actually agree with Livy and Kevin as well. There’s multiple individuals in the SLAA group I attend that have committed to no sexual contact (even with self) outside of a healthy relationship. When my addiction surfaced I participated in a “reboot” where I abstained from all sexual contact (again, even with self) for over a year and this helped with multiple aspects of my acting out. To be completely transparent though, I don’t currently follow this rule myself but only out of medical necessity, which probably sounds like bullshit lol, but I promise it’s not. After my medical thing is finished I plan to return to abstinence outside of a healthy relationship because I also see great value in it.

Just my two cents though! :light_blue_heart:

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1844

I really like this, it gives me a great feeling of peace via the ability to just trust in the processes of life. Something bigger than me knows what’s going on and how to make certain that things go as they need to.

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1845

Day 19 sober. No PMO. I am longing to be a wholo month sober

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1846

@ErinTheSideOfCaution I belong to SLAA and I am of those who have committed to no sexual contact. I agree with your post

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1847

I agree with we, acting out irresponsibily is definitely is a problem, but the main problem with some programs is they are about being purist, perfect. This bar is so extremely high and in my view unrealistic. This makes one hate oneself so much more than they already do. And then they are constantly run by fear.
I am bad, horrible.
As when one constantly is hyper monitoring oneself, when they do not have a good foundation of self love and compassion, then it is self-flaggetion.

Ones standards should be realistic, the more away one is from self love the more dogmatic one becomes as it all then becomes of this illusionary image that one invests in. If one is addicted to heroin, one cant just give it up in one swoop. You slowly progress towards it, in baby steps. You cant be on the ground floor and expect yourself to keep trying to get on the top floor immediately.

Being addicted to having all your life consumed by fear of a relapse is a different kind of addiction in itself. As you grow and there is more self acceptance, whatever needs to go will go and whatever needs to stay will stay.

Do not seek so much validation with regards to your actions, thoughts etc.

Pushing and effort in my opinion has never worked, in fact it has made things much worse. Easy does it. Progress not perfection, just for today.

Abraham Hicks says that self condemnation is the foundation for self loathing. Chip at it everyday, you are wonderful and beautiful just the way you are. Acceptance not rejection, my lovely friend.

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1848

@leah11 I love your point of view. I cannot be purist. I am a constant relapser but I dream with a sobriety which fix with my deepest longings

1849

Ahem… Hello again, day 1. Hope everyone’s doing well, got some reading to catch up on. I had a falling out working a job where I only sleep in a very bad pattern. After 5 months I was shopping online, drinking lots and lots of espresso, got carried away with my imagination and here I am about 3 weeks later getting after it once again. 2 years down the drain.

Apparently when you sleep like that the prefrontal cortex gets fatigued, will power and such gets weakened dramatically and emotions slip from 0-10 pretty quickly. This would explain why out nowhere I was losing my temper for no reason, which I never, ever did prior - except in college where I had the same schedule.

Anyway, back at it again. Getting stronger.

Edit: I will add that 99% of what I thought I would be interested in during the relapse wasn’t the least bit interesting and I didn’t even look, even though it was essentially a jail break and you can rationalize anything at that point.

The scope of things that generated the (toxic) enthusiasm had drastically minimized which I am extremely thankful for having accomplished in those 2 years. The goal going forward is to finish that job and get it to 100%. I did not know this until I tried, so there’s a “wisdom through excess” aspect to it, which can be very dangerous but nevertheless turned out to be highly informative and reassuring. So that’s what I learned from the most recent set of failures.

Basically:

  1. Take care of yourself physically and mentally so you’re fortified in your routines. Especially sleep.

  2. Be humble or be humbled. I thought I was cured and didn’t have to worry about this happening, but the enemy waits to strike for when you’re weak and let your guard down.

  3. Don’t look back. Doesn’t matter how bad your memory is, you’re on this journey for a reason. Be aggressive, and get after it every day.

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1850

Alright.. Day 8.

Removing lust, sex, porn. All of it.

Got out of a relationship 1.5 months ago.

Im not in the best spot mentally, but, i let a lot go and want to fight. Ive done 410 days before, but enough about the past.

Im ready to move forward, with God, this time.

Here I am..

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1851

Excellent bro, I’m in legit the same spot! (Except I’m married).

Coming up on day 5, but it’s technically a few days longer because I waited to come back. I did a little more than 2 years up to a month ago.

Also I learned sex is no replacement for PMO and vice versa, so I can’t use that mental excuse anymore. They’re just not interchangeable. Hope that helps while you’re single. It’s helped me stop nagging my wife to fulfill certain obligations, but really that didn’t do the trick in the end, it completely fell on me. Good luck, keep up the pace!

Also last thing I realized a lot of addiction management is just life management, so if you get your life under control it’s really not hard. I had a really good thing going up until I got laid off and stopped sleeping at this new job, so that’s a complexity I’m dealing with mainly, not PMO.

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1852

Hi,
So this is my second day of being free of PM. Again… It’s hard to start it over and over again. And this stupid hope that this time will be better. But I don’t think that I hit rock bottom yet…
It’s hard to say friends that you have problem, that you’re addicted…
Be Strong.
Congrats to people who are free of this.

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1853

Was that a reply to me-?

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1854

Congrats on the second day. It’s the beginning of… 5 weeks, 18 months or 32 years. It’s an achievement!

A desire to be free is not stupid. Having hope is never stupid. I understand that it’s your sentiment right now but I would like to give you a more positive mindset from the get-go. Things can change.

You say this not your rock bottom. How much more miserable do you think you need to be? Or are you still debating whether you want to give up your addiction? I don’t mean to be rude by posing these questions, but we, as addicts, have honed to skill of deception of others and ourselves. The starting point of all recovery is brutal honesty and humility, that is being willing to learn. Recovery is possible and achievable. As long as you live, there’s hope.

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1855

I’m sitting here, got done with my leg workout, and I’m drinking green tea.

If I’m being honest, I have commitment issues. I’ve let them dominate my life in both sobriety and when I was drinking. Doing 410 days without porn, sex or anything really changed my life for the better, but I had no true foundation. I was just more curious and as I was quitting drinking, I didn’t want to trade drinking for lust.

As I sit here today, battling the early body and mind changes, I try to recapture the feeling of “I’m curious, I’m curious of what God has in store”.

But, that feeling fails me. So, everyday I just work hard, see my son and go to the gym. It’s of time, It’s of patience and calmness.

I’ve deleted all phone numbers, blocked anything that could jeopardize me as I get back into this.

It’s hard, but, God will provide the strength and better foundations to move forward. Because, Porn, sex all things lust are meaningless. The point of sobriety, is to go to things that matter. Family, Calmness, new clarity, trying new things that are positive and to move forward from the ugliness and desperate attempts to escape.

Let’s round it back to the start.

I have massive commitment issues. For some reasons know and others, I just always feel trapped after awhile. Then I get stuck in my own head. Does that ever go away? Well, I can only work on it and work through those problems, even though they are deep rooted in myself. I haven’t left two things so far, sober in drinking and my son.

Those two things are very good and the purpose of sobriety. Overtime, there was more learning in new things, like fly fishing, how to camp and whatever else good I got into. These things come in sobriety. A new found you.

But, commitment to another person in a relationship is just so tough, then I realized I was just falling into lust. Because, Love and Lust are not the same, and I hated the moment I realized it.

It’s not fair to her, and all she did was show me love. She taught me to open. To enjoy, to give and to hope. When I walked away, I saught to escape my own downfall, but, quickly I realized all I was doing was attempting to escape in poor choices.

It got ugly for a few weeks off and on, and I said, I need to be done. This isn’t you. It’s disgusting, vile. You’re using things, even if i was being honest about it.

It’s day 8. Just grow closer to God. It will get rocky, it will be tough. But, God will give me the strength to seek love and restraint for myself, and to make a deep rooted peace from what isn’t good nor enjoyable.

All of this mess, just not proud of.

Porn truly is fucking disgusting.
Sex with others, is just not ideal for me anymore.
Lust, pushes farther away from what is meaningful.

It’s time to get over it, learn and grow. Because, life is to short to walking into doors that were not meant for me, that only bring despair, sadness and honestly an emotion of nothing.

That’s the idea of Lust.

Love, love is good. Love isn’t sex. Love is just the calm acceptance of another, to help, share and beyond all to just listen without judgement.

Anyways, I’m here, steadfast moving forward, and realizing why I had to escape. Fixing my internal issues, or giving it to God, either or, but a calm declaration that beyond all, I have to be done with it.

The closeness of another that isn’t my wife, will only bring pain.
The watching of Porn will always simply be demonic for me.
The chasing of things that do not matter, will leave me empty handed.

As God moves forward, I will follow, because my choices haven’t left me to much hope, love or care.

Sobriety reigns, even in the toughest time.

Just like drinking… my best drinking day will never beat my worst sober day.

It’s time to truly let go, and seek the problems in my own self to foster a better future with the joy in God.

Will I be perfect…hmm… all I know is what is Good, Stupid and Bad.

To those journeying through this beast of Lust, I commend you.
For it’s a tough fuckin’ road.

One day at a time, One moment and a time. No more “fuck its”, shame and guilt is on the other side.

Time to reach out, time to talk, time for counseling. Time for a meeting.

Day 8.
No porn
No sex
Nothing, except removing my thoughts when they arise…

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1856

Thank you @Olivia for your comment and support.

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1857

3 months 9 days clean from Masturbating till orgasm

21 days clean from viewing porn

Mental clarity is up.

Motivation is higher

Energy is alright

No longer wanting it. The thought of masturbating isn’t really appealing to me.

It wastes my time and energy.

I could be doing more productive habits and actually fun hobbies.

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1858

@sober26 Heyyy there. How’s it going?

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1859

Nice! That’s great man, I also am trying to get back to that “not wanting to do it anymore” mindset I used to be in, until I revived the monster last month.

What are you doing instead? Like, what’s your life generally like such that you’re basically satisfied?

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1860

Mostly working, watching shows and movies, putting more effort into my hobbies: playing magic the gathering (putting effort into a different addiction: cardboard crack…)

I am also trying not to stare at women in public.

I might look for 2 seconds at their face, but i’m trying not to stare at their bodies.

Like i can tell they are beautiful without actually staring at their bodies

Also i feel like life is overwhelming right now, so i guess that helps. I feel like pmo would just be a waste of time and energy when there’s all these other things i need to do: clean around the house, look for other work, work on my values, etc.

Find your why. Why it’s more important to use your time differently then on pmo.

Ex:
Working on your goals for an hour, spending an hour on a good habit/hobby, Cleaning the house for an hour are all so much more fulfilling then jerking off to porn for an hour…

But i think for the first month trying to stay away from mo-ing you just have to find more stimulating things to do. Clean movies, video games, youtube videos

To distract you from urges

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