Well done @Pat_m for continuing to post.
Really good points @Mno I hate confrontation and seem to be all or nothing. I am getting better though and will keep in mind that by staying silent I am not helping.
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That’s exactly why I don’t do AA or NA or any A too. I tried but I can’t bend my mind to the higher power stuff.
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Really good point about the AA programme, hadn’t considered that. I am glad it helps so many but like you, that approach isn’t for me.
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Samesies on the 12-step aversion. I will say, though, earlier in sobriety I called in on zoom to several different AA and NA meetings, mostly to observe and went as far as to turn my camera on in one group that I gelled with and contributed a bit. That helped me at the time with exploring my options and feeling less alone, especially when I was showing my face and people all the way across the pond in England learned my name and greeted me warmly. For me the real sticking point was the pressure to introduce myself each time with the words, “and I’m an alcoholic.” I do not identify using that label IRL almost as adamantly as I don’t identify as religious or believing in a god. The combination was a killer. I actually miss that group of regulars, though!
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Yes, completely understand that. I don’t believe I am an alcoholic as such, or that I have a disease 
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I hear you. I think that the medical/disease model for treatment of addiction has its place for some, but it is a narrow view, indeed.
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What has helped with drama and conflict…here and in life…there are some people, in every group, that need drama and conflict…it validates them as a human being…resist the temptation (which is extremely hard for me at times) to feed into the drama and conflict…and it passes faster.
So, for me…I engage as little as possible with those people. On here, I dont read or respond (outside of my moderator role).
In life, I remember that we are all human…and some times hurt people, hurt people. There is nothing I can do about. I interact minimally, treat them as I would want to be treated and move along. Then, because I am human…I vent to someone close to me.
I know if you read on here, that some times us “venters” are not appreciated. Sometimes venting is the best way of vocalizing how you are feeling and letting it go.
To be honest, it was one the greatest gifts of sobriety, the ability to let it go. I admit, I have a lot of work on it, but it’s getting better.
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I’m a newbie on day 2 and so glad I found this thread. It was suggested elsewhere that I read “Quit like a Woman” and I’m devouring it. It speaks so much to me on many levels, one of which is why AA just would never work for me. The whole putting the wheel in some other power’s hands, atonement, penance etc feels way too antiquated and self-punishing for me (but I completely acknowledge it has helped many people). I grew up in a very Catholic household (no longer practicing in adulthood) so the whole concept of AA bugs me. I like the idea of freeing yourself from suffering and approaching sobriety as a joyful opportunity. I am on these very early shaky days, but I want to feel hope rather than a self-flogging repeatedly over every terrible moment and mistake to continue to suffer. I think it’s important to remember that problematic path we’ve taken, but also look forward to the possibility of a beautiful new path ahead.
Wish me luck.
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Well done on day 2!! I love that book so much…she put into words how I had been feeling for years. It may not resonate with everyone, but it sure did with me. You may also find support in We Are The Luckiest…plus, reading keeps our mind busy.
Early days are rough, no joke, but this is a great place to turn to read, soak it in, get tips and occupy our mind. Keep going, it gets better.
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Glad you’re here and on this journey! I bought the book a long time ago and you’ve given me the push to finally start reading it today.
I’m curious if anyone else does this, but when a book really captures my attention I tend to “devour it,” as you put it. If I feel like I sped through it too much, I’ll go back after letting it sink in for a while and reread, taking notes in my journal of phrases that hit home or thoughts it brought up for me. It’s pretty time consuming so I’m considering setting aside time to read with a few minutes to write in my journal afterward, instead. That requires me to practice some discipline and not just keep on reading, though!
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@ArtMama I just finished We Are The Luckiest and it so resonated with me! Highly recommend. That’s the book I’m considering rereading at some point 
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That is such a good idea, I keep trying to slow down and absorb it!
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I’ve definitely taken breaks without the finality of deleting my account. The vibe shifts sometimes and can feel heated but it always calms down again. We have great moderators who have a huge hand in this. I’m curious if you know about muting threads or even people so you don’t see them in your feed or on threads? It has helped me a lot over the years.
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I didn’t figure you were, you are kind and thoughtful! Just keep it in mind if you’d ever rather not see something that’s upsetting in the future. 
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You probably are not wrong. Most of us, our personalities…good or bad, are a product of our upbringing and environment we live in. I am somewhat of a control freak…part of that is from my mom…
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Me too…and I did walk away “permanently”…I came back…be cause in my time here…I found my tribe, and needed them.
What I have found, is that tribe is where I go to when things flare up.
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Me too, amigo! Me too.
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As I said to Jay Liza in private before she left, we are lucky to have you and Menno as moderators, and in this thread. Wise people
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the forum goes thru ups and downs for sure and like any community, we all bring our own perspective, life experiences, communication styles, belief systems, culture, etc etc to our interactions. It can be challenging with a worldwide forum…so many cultures, languages, experiences. We do try to keep the focus on sobriety, community and support. We all suffer when dust ups occur. And I believe we try to be mindful that early recovery and life in general are hard and raw enough without this place also being a battleground.
Offering grace to others, and ourselves, is often required IMHO.
I have certainly learned a lot on here…not just about sobriety and recovery, but about communication, humans, allowing people their experience and feelings, and a myriad of other things.
Many people leave, they often return. I hope jay.liza will as well.
This thread has been a catalyst for many interesting discussions and viewpoints and I am thankful for it. I am not a religious person (recovering Catholic), but I do believe in energy. I really enjoy reading people’s experiences and viewpoints. Living in the Bible belt of the southern US, these conversations are not commonplace (nor are Catholics, recovering or practicing). It is always nice to have a ‘safe space to land’ here.
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I get that. Response posts can be thoughtless at times, where it’s more about the responder projecting their own internal struggles and uncertainties, instead of engaging in a constructive / non-confrontational way.
Our conversations, our interactions, are like a garden. Every plant has its place. There’s a balance to that garden though, and sometimes a plant is the wrong plant or in the wrong place, and you need to do a little weeding 
Speaking of weeding out the unhelpful plants from a user’s Talking Sober experience:
(I saw you mentioned above that you personally didn’t feel targeted but I’m giving this link here mainly for others who may find it helpful. Thanks for bringing up the topic! It’s an important awareness to have.)
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