Thank you for sharing Derek, I’m very sorry for the loss of your friend : (
That’s hard 
Sorry for your loss.
But thank you for sharing, we are never “cured”
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Sorry to hear about your pal. What a damn reminder. I’m glad you are sober today and reaching out to your people. 
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If you aren’t an alcoholic getting, and staying, sober should be easy. If you find that you can’t stop, or keep resetting, then you’re probably an alcoholic. I see a lot of people claim they aren’t alcoholic because they don’t have a low bottom, and they can’t seem to quit. On the other hand I know plenty of low bottom, drunks and druggies, who have been sober for quite a while now…
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This is why I consider my Brojo an investment in sobriety. If I have a bad day, 30 minutes on then heavy bag and I am as right as rain.
I’m not an alcoholic… 
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Don’t start drinking or you will be!!!
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You can’t give away what you don’t have. I’ll take my advice from people who aren’t actively drinking.
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Moderation reminds me of a joke I heard a pastor say at church.
A man gets pulled over for running a stop sign. When the officer approaches the man, he explains that he didn’t stop, but he at least slowed down.
The officer gets out his nightstick and starts beating the man over the head with it.
“Now,” the officer says, “Do you want me to stop, or do you want me to slow down?”
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Excuse me a second, I need to wipe the coffee spit off my keyboard…
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I see the age old “debate” raises its head again on a thread where the OP was only asking a question about spending money on something! Asking whether it was worth spending that money.
Why do people have to continuously slate AA.
To my mind they are not actually accepting their role in the whole getting sober process!
All “programs” whether they be 12 step, CBT, Rehab whatever are all a means to an end.
The main bulk of the work comes from US.
You, me, everybody who has an addiction.
We use these systems to help ourselves.
Yes we can throw all the money we want at this but if we are not prepared to actually put the deep down soul busting hard work into it then it is a waste of money.
Don’t get me wrong, some people need the extra boost that a residential rehab can offer. I mean I didn’t go anywhere for 4 days, but spent that time, when I wasn’t sleeping, reading about my addiction. And what I could be doing to help myself. I only really went back to work because I had no money and no insurance! I didn’t feel emotionally or physically fit enough!
What I found out was that I am an Alcoholic. It’s not nice to think this.
Took me 2 years from the time I broke down in tears and told my wife to the time when I woke up on my kitchen floor and said to myself " Yep. I really am an Alcoholic"
Call it what you want to try and take the social shame away but ultimately I have no control over alcohol.
I really just wanted to say that the hard work? It has to come from us.
Deep inside of us!
And it fucking hurts!
But we have to stop finding excuses, “oh this won’t work for me because I’m not religious”
Have you actually read the big book?
The chapter We Agnostics?
“Oh this won’t work for me because I don’t drive and the nearest meeting, ( be it AA, SMART whatever) is miles away”
We can have online meetings, they all run online meetings.
" I can’t go to a meeting because I don’t feel comfortable with people"
Get out there and get uncomfortable. Not many people like doing this sort of thing. But if it’s going to be the difference between getting sober and struggling. I know what I would do.
All of the above, in my opinion are excuses because anything is possible if you want something that bad.
But the first thing one has to do is come to terms with accepting wholesale, what, who we have become. With that acceptance comes the opening of the mind.
And for the love of lue.
Stop running down what you don’t like or understand.
It may not be your thing but it could be someone’s.
And you just might put that person off doing something that could save their life.
Thank you for reading.
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Aaand Breathe… Well said.
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I think part of the problem is that as soon as as someone suggest AA they are labeled as a fanatic. But in reality I support any type of program so long as you are doing something. I prefer AA because it has worked for me. But there’s a solid anti- AA crowd that trashes AA every chance they get. But I say one thing about some stupid ass book and I’m the bad guy. The double standard on this forum is ridiculous. AA gets bashed everyday and the mods tell us to respect everyone’s opinion. I tell someone not to waste their money on a $600 webinar and look what happens. No wonder people with long term sobriety don’t stick around here long.
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Yes Derek I totally agree.
All I gotta say to that is get the fuck over it!
It doesn’t have to define us for the rest of our lifes.
I am an alcoholic but I’m still Geoff.
A little story if I may, without upsetting people.
I had a very hard time coming to terms with the fact that my daughter is autistic. When that word was first mentioned I would not accept it.
I thought that it would hinder her, labelled like that.
But. Since getting involved in the whole diagnosis process I have come to realise that it’s not detrimental.
People see it as such still.
But that is on them. Not my daughter. She has struggled to get work because of this. But obviously we can’t prove it
What it has done is open up a whole world of help and assistance for her that if we had not got the diagnosis, would not be there.
It ment, I had to open my mind to this fact.
Just like I open my mind and accepted that I am an alcoholic and I need help.
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Yeah, this is what prompted me to say what I did. The OP’s question was valid. Your answer was valid.
I’ve said it before. Why spend money on something you can get for free?
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Not necessarily a mod though. Or do you know it was
There’s a double standard. And you know it’s true
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When I joined TS, the first thing I searched was AA and I was pretty shocked at the shame and hate it got. Coincidentally, there wasn’t a lot of sobriety on the forum save for a few peeps who had more than 6 months and a couple years, and those folks with some sobriety were… shockingly… people who used AA
This forum has a lot more sobriety now honestly, I’ve seen quite a few people hit their year, and more. And a large number of them are AA goers, hell 3 of the 4 mods go to AA.
If you try the 30 day experiment and it works for you, and you want to spend 600 on the other part, get after it. I don’t got nothing against Annie Grace and her monetizing or capitalizing of material she puts together for your consumption.
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I honestly don’t give a shit about her or her book. If someone gets sober using it then good for them. But this whole profiteering off the backs of the broken pisses me off. And since AA gets bashed so frequently then starting a few anti-Annie threads is probably just what the forum needs.
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This can also be said about Pharma as well. Oh look what this drug does. Yay we’ll charge a lot of money for it!
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