My opinion…you can relapse after significant sobriety and return to heavy long term drinking. That would be a relapse in my mind. It’s not uncommon (sadly) but it definitely doesn’t happen to everyone.
Having drinks after 24 hours is of abstaining isn’t a relapse…that’s Tuesday!!
I’ve read too many posts that are “I keep relapsing. I go, like, one day and then I give in a drink again.” I want to scream “That’s not relapsing…you never STOPPED drinking!!”
But I don’t. I put on my encouragement hat and try to help that person.
My own personal experience with “relapse”? Nah, they weren’t relapses. I just wasn’t ready to quit. I could go 14 days, 30days, 60 days, 90 days…but I always went back to alcohol. I call it relapse on the board to show that I understand what they are going through but the truth is I wasn’t ready to fully recover yet. I THINK I’m there now…I feel like I am. But I’m not stupid, I know anything could happen tomorrow. But for TODAY I will stay sober!!
One of my good friends, her ex husband was a drinker when they met 25 years ago. Family did an intervention and he quit drinking and they got married. Raised up their daughter and my friend left the loveless but perfectly adequate marriage about 7 years ago. He started drinking again …after all those years sober…and quickly spiraled into losing his job, house, everything. In and out of rehab for about 4 years. Finally back sober.
That was definitely a relapse in my book.
And I get what you’re saying about all the slips not being relapses and agree 100%. I think we get stuck on verbiage…I know I have. Good clarification, thanks.
I see things a little differently. I think that almost every member here has a desire to stop their drug of choice. If they didn’t, they wouldn’t be here. And I accept and respect that.
I believe in “Every Try Counts”. I love that campaign. It inspired me to never give up and to eventually get back on TS.
And if a member picks up after being sober for 1 year, I’m going to assume that to be a relapse. I’m going to do the same for someone with 90 days, or 30, or a week, or a day. Whom am I to judge? I know for myself, I’ve wanted to quit my DOC for over 25 years, and I’ve relapsed 100’s of times. And these were times when I was going to meetings, getting support, being on TS, etc. Did I have more porn to use? No, I had more learning and more healing to do. Because my desire to stop never changed. I was going to 5 meetings a week at one time. Believe me. The desire to stop was there.
So for me, it just wasn’t about deciding to stop. Because there’s always those moments where I lose clarity; I’m not thinking clearly, I’m not in the best state of mind. I’ve noticed these characteristics in a lot of addicts. For some of us these moments of unclarity occur more often then others.
I know its easy to lose patience with those chronic resetters, especially if it seems like their not doing a whole lot of changes in their life. we’re stubborn like that. Sometimes, we want to do things our way, and not God’s way. Some things will work better for some people than others. Some of us will have to work harder at it than others. But I choose to believe that the desire to quit is in everyone here on TS. And I believe that if there’s a desire, then there’s also a readiness.
Beautifully said, each their own path and their own consequences. We find ourselves here because we want to change…not everyone can or will…but at one point, we all chose TS because we yearned for change.
Yes…this is true…but wanting to quit doesn’t mean you’re quite ready. I have wanted to quit (truly WANT) for 2 years before I was actually ready to do it.
When someone says “you still have some drinking to do” (or whatever the DOC is) it isn’t meant as hurtful or dismissive, it is just honest truth. We can still be supportive without condescending.
But that doesn’t mean it’s not frustrating. It’s like my own kids doing the same stupid crap over and over. I want to yell at them but I don’t. I kindly try to direct them to a better path. But I’m not going to say “it’s okay”…at least not after the tenth time.
I know for me I wanted the best of both worlds. I wanted to quit, but I still wanted to get high. I wanted all the fun, without all the consequences. Until the consequences outweighed the benefits I received I stood no chance of quitting. For me the scale had to be tipped 99% consequences and 1% benefits. And that might be a stretch.
From what I’ve seen of @VSue progression, she went from trying to fit sobriety into her life to trying to fit her life into her sobriety.
She works a solid program, some of her insights have caused me much reflection, especially the smaller topics that are just kind of questions or posts on how she’s feeling about a certain thing.
Sometimes people do have more drinking to do. I’m not going to gladhand everyone who has relapsed a 100 times. When you wake up and go about and say, I’m done, and you drink that night because you lived the same ground hogs day you have for 3 years, that’s not a relapse, it’s just another day in the life of a drunk.
I can understand that it must be frustrating to see others constantly relapsing without making any attempt to go to a meeting, or getting counseling, etc.
Trying the same thing over and over again expecting different results; the definition of insanity.
I get your point. Someone’s got to stop using first before referring to the last episode as a relapse. And some of the excuses that I’ve heard on why meetings are not right for them are unacceptable.
You have grown a lot over these past few years. I still see readiness as more of a process than as an event. And over time, I’ve seen that readiness grow in you. And even before the counseling and AA, I still saw some readiness.
were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character
I don’t think I’ve mastered this one yet. I don’t think any of us has. (except for @Yoda-Stevie, of course, lol) I still crave, often. But each day my readiness grows.
I trust that not only there is desire in the relapsers in TS, but also at least some readiness.
I welcome the relapsers here. They don’t trigger me. They do remind me of myself, and offer a fresh look at where I was and where I could end up.
But thanks for sharing those @VSue. Someone struggling to get sobriety would find those behaviors to be a next step if they haven’t tried them before.
I am ready for God to remove all character defects, and He is indeed working on it. However, I should wear a shirt that says “Pardon my mess, while I remodel.”
All I can do is to take a disciplined approach to Kaizen, to work at getting better at getting better. Some days I hit all the notes in the song of the day. Some days all I can do is stay sober, because sober IS better, and another day of sobriety means that I am better today than I was yesterday.
“Before I learned the art, a punch was just a punch, and a kick, just a kick. After I learned the art, a punch was no longer a punch, a kick, no longer a kick. Now that I understand the art, a punch is just a punch and a kick is just a kick.”
Now, please explain the quote. It’s way to much for my uncaffeinated brain this Sunday morning. I’m thinking it’s just a really poetic way of saying “it’s not easy but it is simple”??? The punch isn’t just a punch but is just a punch? Am I close?
While I think this is one of those quotes that we can each apply to some aspects of our lives, with regards to sobriety, here’s how it speaks to me:
When we are actively drinking or using, and have yet to fully commit to sobriety, we think being sober is nothing more than not drinking or using. Each break, or “relapse” is just an oscillation between using and sobriety.
Once we’ve fully committed to sobriety, we see the magic, and understand that there’s so much more to being clean and sober, that a “slip” or “relapse” is not a natural part of recovery.
Once sobriety is fully engrained in our being, where drinking or using would be such a radical departure from who we now are, we can see a “relapse”, “slip” or whatever euphemism chosen to describe it for what it really is. As you so aptly put it previously: it’s not a relapse, because one never learned or understood what sobriety really is.
Where am I? I’m in that “learning the magic” stage, I think.
